Crowdfunding : your thoughts?

[Dark Art]

Hear ye, hear ye all of you naysaying nonbelievers and the rest of the fair unreal world wanderers. When a man who steadily delivered rock solid content for good 20 years tells you he'll do good on his promises and will deliver again - you listen. The right thing to do would be to say "Great stuff, more content from one of the most reliable devs in the gaming world, how can we help?" Anything else is blaspheming nonsense. And what do we do with blasphemers in the iron age? Anyone?

Come on guys, its Erkka we are talking about. Not just some kid who learned to code "hello world" and thinks himself a game developer who can start a crowdfunding campaign to make animated kittens. Its in our best interest to not only support this endeavor personally, but to spread the word. I mean did anyone hear of someone even remotely as dedicated as Erkka or Sami? In the whole bloody gaming world I can think of only two names - Tarn and Zach Adams. Thats it. So spread the word and give them your money. Or give them your money and then spread the word. That part is up you 

P.S. I am sure we'll hear no more of this naysaying, but I'll go prepare a few stakes and gather some firewood. You know, just in case

[JP_Finn]

... as for dark ages Finnish blasphemers... do absolutely nothing... spirits would correct their ways, there’d be no reason for folks to intervene.
If you’ve done “bird thief quest” you’ll know the attitude going against someone else: they might even put a spell on you. Better to keep to yourself.

[Dark Art]

Bah... Shows what you know. Stakes and firewood are essential parts of very potent purification ritual I've heard about. Does wonders and quite literally eradicates all negative energy. Its the good stuff I tell ya, tried and tested through and through.

[JP_Finn]

Stakes not so much but sizable piece of firewood could be carved into seita. More common would be to carve a tall stump instead.

[Dark Art]

Anyway, thats all fun, but here is the real kicker - how can we, as the community, support this endeavor? I mean, sure, support the campaign financially, but what else? I have not been involved much with other gaming communities except one, so I am a bit at the loss here. Where do folks hang out and talk about these things nowadays? I am sure we can give the jumpstart to Erkka's project it needs to succeed. So lets hear it.

[Erkka]

Hello! Just a quick note for those who might have been waiting for further news;

After carefully considering all the feedback I decided to postpone the crowdfunding campaign launch until January / February 2021, depending on how the development goes.

So: Thanks for all the feedback and help. I'll be back with more news later on.

[Labtop 215]

Personally, I support projects when they reach a point that I would be happy playing with as is.  I've been "burned" too many times in the past, and even from good developers, I am now always skeptical.  It's nothing personal.

[Ezezaguna]

I wish you the best for the project, I really love the work of you two.

Also, have you considered doing crowdfunding or something similar for supporting extra content for UrW? (besides the donations).

Good luck!

[Erkka]

have you considered doing crowdfunding or something similar for supporting extra content for UrW?

This is not an alien idea for us  And I think something like that is the likely next step.

[jonottawa]

My take, for what it's worth, as someone who doesn't know you:

I'd have taken that job in a heartbeat. Income, responsibility, self-respect, possibly meeting the future mother of your children ... That's what most men need.

Therapy doesn't cure depression. It makes it worse because you spend hours dwelling on your problems ad infinitum. This hypno-gal seems like she might be exploiting your loneliness and her going rate seems awfully high for someone who is having trouble paying the bills.

If you're not obsessed with a game concept that you MUST bring to fruition, you probably shouldn't. The process shouldn't be: My dream is to be an indie game developer, now what game should I develop? The process should be: This game that doesn't exist yet is the most amazing idea I've ever had and I cannot rest until I bring it into reality.

[Labtop 215]

Therapy doesn't cure depression. It makes it worse because you spend hours dwelling on your problems ad infinitum. This hypno-gal seems like she might be exploiting your loneliness and her going rate seems awfully high for someone who is having trouble paying the bills.

I'm just going to point out that this sounds like very dangerous advice.  Not seeking help for mental health issues can result in a horrible downward spiral of debilitation and self harm.  While it's true that you should vet professionals for their credentials and ensure their cost don't run you into debt, not getting help is a very bad option to take.  He states that he's been through some traumatic events in his life, and it has left him feeling dissociated from himself.  That's serious, and he's right not to ignore it.

[Erkka]

My take, for what it's worth, as someone who doesn't know you:

Thanks for the feedback!

I'd have taken that job in a heartbeat. Income, responsibility, self-respect, possibly meeting the future mother of your children ... That's what most men need.

Sure, I do understand that point of view. But my personal situation happens to be a little bit different;

I already do have an income, responsibility and self-respect. For years I've been self-employed. This year I've sustained myself doing massage, coding custom office solutions, and doing basic lumberjack and house renovation work for my neighbours. But this autumn I've seen decrease in those job opportunities, so my question is if I'd like to seek more odd jobs, or to apply for a full-time job, or if I should pursue my own creative ideas with indie game development. Personally, my self-respect isn't tied to the amount of money I earn, but there is a connection, still. I feel that pursuing my own project plans also makes me feel more fulfilled. Applying for a full-time job would've felt a bit like "Oh, I need to work for others for my own plans are probably just going to fail." So, from the self-respect point of view I'm all willing to keep on being a starving artist 

My son is already 27 years old. Sure, those were great times in my life when my son was smaller. But now I have a 'been-there-done-that' feeling, having absolutely no intention to having more kids. Instead, I enjoy this mid-life freedom.

Therapy doesn't cure depression. It makes it worse because you spend hours dwelling on your problems ad infinitum.

Where does that come from? Is it your personal experience? If so, feel free to send me a personal message if you wish to discuss in private.

I have more than 20 years of experience with different methods of therapy. Yes, there are those kinds which aren't always that helpful. But I've been lucky to find the professionals I like to work with, so that the therapeutic process has been focused on the solutions, instead of dwelling on the problems. I know it might be deeply frustrating if ones first experiences with therapy are not good. But I encourage people to keep on seeking. For finding a good therapist can be of great help.

This hypno-gal seems like she might be exploiting your loneliness and her going rate seems awfully high for someone who is having trouble paying the bills.

I do understand that kind of concern. But don't worry; that hypno-gal is my personal friend. She knows my situation and offered to work with me for free. I don't have therapy bills to pay. But I was struggling with winter tyres for the car, and with replacing the water pump in my dwell.

(Also, in the beginning you said you don't know me. And then you assume I might be suffering from loneliness. I have no idea where does that come from, did I write so? Or is it just an assumption you are making based on what?)

If you're not obsessed with a game concept that you MUST bring to fruition, you probably shouldn't. The process shouldn't be: My dream is to be an indie game developer, now what game should I develop? The process should be: This game that doesn't exist yet is the most amazing idea I've ever had and I cannot rest until I bring it into reality.

The story with not applying for a full-time job was supposed to illustrate that idea. That my desire with indie game development has reached such an level that I'm willing to starving artist to make my projects become true. And, in my case it is not about having the most amazing idea ever - the question has been that I have half a dozen of ideas I like, and then because of my depression-like symptoms I've had trouble picking just an one idea to persistently focus on. Now, with the great help of therapy, friends and other therapeutic processes I finally enjoy a sense of inner clarity and focus. I have chosen one idea to focus on. Sure, it remains to be seen if anyone else will like my idea  So, I'll keep on doing the starving artist thing until I have enough of a demo to probe the possible audience reception.

[jonottawa]

I'm a traditionalist. I believe that men need a purpose and that purpose for millennia has been to provide for one's wife and children and to defend one's tribe/nation, while trying to set a good example for the next generation and practicing the religious faith of one's people.

I'm guessing you can't relate to that, and that's fine. If what you're doing is working for you, then by all means keep doing it.

"Therapy doesn't cure depression."

"Where does that come from? ... I have more than 20 years of experience with different methods of therapy."

Asked and answered.

I'm glad to hear your friend is helping you for free. (Though out of respect for her ability to attract paying customers, you might not want to share that info around too much.) If my contribution here has been nothing more than to allay potential concerns that any donations to this campaign might end up lining the pockets of an e-girl, it has been worthwhile. As for why I assumed you were lonely, it's because you complained of depression, and most single men in their 40's who barely make ends meet aren't getting much female companionship. If you're the exception, kudos to you.

[Erkka]

Yes, I think it is understandable and acceptable that different people might have different reasons for not placing any money in a crowdfunding campaign. Over the years urw followers have been suggesting us "Hey guys, you should try indiegogo, it would be good for you!" or "Hey Enormous Elk, are you familiar with Patreon? Try that, it would be good for you!". And now I felt that with my project plans Indiegogo might indeed be worth trying. The good thing is that those who are sceptical don't need to donate - it is perfectly okay just to wait for the finished product and then see if a new game seems like worth buying. So, in that sense I'm all fine with different people having their own reasons of being sceptical.

And naturally, it might be that a  crowdfunding campaign won't be that successful. But for that there is always a plan B, no problem.

The other stuff is going more off-topic, but I think at this point we can allow the thread to de-rail a bit. For the actual project news will be posted in a separate thread sometime in the beginning of 2021.

that purpose for millennia has been to provide for one's wife and children and to defend one's tribe/nation, while trying to set a good example for the next generation and practicing the religious faith of one's people.

I'm guessing you can't relate to that, and that's fine.

I must admit that this, again, leaves me somewhat confused. It would be interesting to hear what makes you guess that I can't relate to the traditional virtues you listed?

[jonottawa]

I must admit that this, again, leaves me somewhat confused. It would be interesting to hear what makes you guess that I can't relate to the traditional virtues you listed?

I would guess that for any number of reasons but maybe the main 2 are:

1) You live in a nation that has been heavily indoctrinated with anti-traditional, globalist values and so as a subset of that population, it's reasonable to guess that you have been successfully indoctrinated as well. (If I reach into a jar of jelly beans, 90% of which are black and 10% of which are red, and pulled out a jelly bean at random, I would guess that I held a black jelly bean. Of course my guess would not always be correct.)

2) You would be making different choices if your values were similar to mine.

But I hope that the point of those 2 short paragraphs was clear: I think a purpose-driven life, in alignment with the purpose our forefathers had, might be a solution for someone who struggles with depression in spite of having undergone 20+ years of therapy but that if you have found a different solution that is working, then that's wonderful news and I would encourage you to keep doing whatever that is. And if I have misread the situation and am wrong, and your values are similar to mine, then I'm absolutely delighted to be wrong about that.