[to 3.63 only] Community mod BAC: Smith, Cooking, Survival, Carpentry, Sewing

[KKarlssoNN]

Is there a way to give myself items or start out with certain picked items? I'd like to start with a fishing rod, spear, fine knife, woodsman's axe, decent bow, 10 arrows and warm clothes. Is there a debug or dev mode or something? I've looked through my character file and i can't find my inventory.

I don't think its cheating because a guy could start out with these anyways through the RNG. From the perspective of roleplaying: I left my home to fend for myself and as a parting gift was given or allowed to keep these items i made myself\made by my family\community\ or passed down through generations.

It would be cool if the game had a custom start where the player would be given a certain number of points to select their starting inventory based around the gear's value number. 

[Signatus]

Is there a way to give myself items or start out with certain picked items? I'd like to start with a fishing rod, spear, fine knife, woodsman's axe, decent bow, 10 arrows and warm clothes. Is there a debug or dev mode or something? I've looked through my character file and i can't find my inventory.

I don't think its cheating because a guy could start out with these anyways through the RNG. From the perspective of roleplaying: I left my home to fend for myself and as a parting gift was given or allowed to keep these items i made myself\made by my family\community\ or passed down through generations.

I would be cool if the game had a custom start where the player would be given a certain number of points to select their starting inventory based around the gear's value number.

The only way I see that happening is using recipes to give that to you, then discarding whatever you started with. I made a primitive no iron character and immediately discarded the iron axe and knife and made stone versions, for example.

You can make a test menu (I have a diy_test.txt file for my test recipes) and then assign it a letter in the menudef file when I want to use it (I'm using Q). You can just make recipes with no ingredients and 1 minute duration to get those items and off you go.

[Brygun]

The only way I see that happening is using recipes to give that to you, then discarding whatever you started with. I made a primitive no iron character and immediately discarded the iron axe and knife and made stone versions, for example.

You can make a test menu (I have a diy_test.txt file for my test recipes) and then assign it a letter in the menudef file when I want to use it (I'm using Q). You can just make recipes with no ingredients and 1 minute duration to get those items and off you go.

Pretty much that. Ps, its a little off topic for the BAC mod thread. Please start a fresh thread for more discussion on that. I will add just a quick bit more.

Shift-D when you stand on things discards them

You will need the menudef like Signatus described. The menudef_BAC.txt includes mentioning a few letters free and as of right now IIRC you can use two of the letters for your own menus.

Once items are made in the game you can remove the menu entry. The data is already in the character save. If you had custom grahpics you will want to leave those in the graphics directories as the pointer will come up with an invisible blank if no match is found (which is better than crashing the game)


For your free items you will need to match the vanilla name exactly in a recipe like

[SUBMENU_START Freebie]

.Exact name. /1m/
{Rock} '+free start'


[SUBMENU_END Freebie]


Aside from that I started Novrus with the "abandoned camp" to reprsent random gifts from his family, and boy it weren't much. You could also reimagine the disasterous hunt as gifts given rather than your father's horrible death.

[Brygun]

Minor

diy_BAC_Transport.txt

Added improved comments for the birch-bark punt. No changes to the recipes this time.

comments include a new  link to another 1 hour video on making a canoe.

// A crafter in Minnesota explaining the steps
// https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFSjKRnUzVo&t

And some mentions affirming the 600 ft of cordage for a real canoe. At 10 {Tying equipment} you guys are getting off easy 

[KKarlssoNN]

Hey guys, I made a thread with my attempt at doing what i posted earlier. Help would be most appreciated, I can't get it to work. Signatus... if possible could you upload your diy_test.txt file so i could use it as a example over in my thread.   

[Signatus]

@Brygun there's a typo in the {Branch} item on the .Medieval drill. recipe, the brackets are wrong.

Ialso noticed that a lot of ironworking is using TIMBERCRAFT rather than CARPENTRY. Is this on purpose as well?

[Brygun]

Update

As per report from Signatus

Fix of {Branch} bracket for Medieval drill

Ironworking reviewed. Numerous switches from Timbercraft to Carpentry.

Timbercraft in place when dealing with raw ores

Carpentry used when hammering and shaping. This includes changing iron billet into a steel billet.

[Brygun]

Update

Adds Frostbit's .Big Rock. to biy_BAC_standard.txt

This adds a late game activity of making stone walls around your compound

[Signatus]

I found a possible problem... I noticed while testing a coin-making addition that the prices are off. It seem that PRICE:1 is equal to an arrow's price, which is supposedly 8. With some small coins valued at 0.1 each I was able to buy an arrow for 10 of them. At 0.125 price I could buy it with 8.

This means that a lot of items need their prices tweaked. An iron bloom is worth 10 arrows I think. This doesn't seem right.

What should be the price of iron itself, per pound? This could make it easier to determine pricing.

Also, would smelting copper/silver/gold into coins make sense? I think we could try to balance its yield or something, but could be interesting. My idea to emulate the rarity of the ores is to depend on some specific combination of biomes. For example, being at a mountain AND near some rapids. Or a cave near 2 or 3 types of mire. It should be possible to eventually find it, though.

Another way to do it is to create "herbs" that grow on specific biomes with low commonness and different yields. That would make it more dynamic how you find them rather than finding one spot and stopping there.

The same approach could be take in regards to iron, I guess, but it's so much common it might not be worth it.

Anyway, I made coins of 0.15, 0.12 and 0.18 for copper/silver/gold with values 0.1/1/20. Bringing copper coins to 0.30 might help underpowering them because being more common I was mining and smelting it bigger batches.

One could donate coins to villages in order to simulate them having some to buy stuff from you. Let me know what you think

[Brygun]

The economics have always been a question.

Currently IIRC the prices of the bloom and iron billet are unchanged from Boudidda's mod. Other iron goods like iron nails were then based on the iron billet to be (was it) 2 times to value a simple worked iron object.

Axes themselves have their prices as per the Unreal World vanilla objects. Don't recall shifting anything unless it was to lower a stone version.

It was only really in the carpentry decorations I had little to go by in terms of what value to give them. Even the punts have a base vanilla punt with a known price.

All of this assumes the "price" from the wiki is the same as the [Price:#] which if its not an issue.

Was the wiki set to price 1 = 1 squirrel hide? if so how does 1 squirrel hide compare to arrows?


>>>>>

A coin system is pretty much contrary to the intended barter system of vanilla Unreal World.  I actually find the non-coin system in UrW refreshing from most fantasy games.  You are happy to develop one but I don't expect to bring it into the BAC.

I suggest making a seperate thread for a coin mod.

You can keep BAC compatibility if you aim for the 1-2 menu lists which BAC left free for personal customization.

>>>>

On the metal values though...

Being early iron age the iron itself is a very valuable item. As you can see in games where you are not a smith getting a collection of axes is a major achievement. A set of five axes if you weighed just the iron might be 15-20 lbs of worked up iron for months of work. Arrows can be made a several in a day.

The values of metals need to be considered for the period values vs the modern age. In today's world there is a comparatively vast amount of metal. Think of a locker from school or a sports facility. That amount of metal by weight could make you how many tools?

Bronze is now in UrW as a vanilla trade good. Decorative pieces get much of their value from the quality of art. So I wouldn't want to hazard a guess on simple coin values. Gold is even trickier. Both bronze and gold are of course period items.

Likewise extending discussion on the bronze/gold values should be moved off to a separate thread though you have my initial views on the subject for your perusal.

 

[JEB Davis]

I'm in agreement with Brygun that coins are out of place in UrW.

This is shaping up to be quite a mod 
Thanks to ALL of you working on it.

[Acolyte]

Coins maybe not, but ingots? Small ingots of metal were likely traded at this time, heck they've found stone in much earlier sites that's non native that likely would have been traded. People trade whatever's valuable.

Trick is how to put this into the economy.

  - Shane

[Brygun]

I've heard references to the Norse armbands of metal (gold or otherwise) being traded off piece by piece. The pieces would be weighed at the time of transaction.

I do think it could be an interesting chat in another thread.

Other ingots might be possible to create the bronze decorations already in vanilla.

BAC at this point is running into space issues.

A set of bronze creation is likely go be ~5 recipes just to mine/process/refine the materials to make bronze. Remember bronze isn't a natural ore like iron. Its copper with other things added in.

Then you would need ~5 recipes for making bronze things.

Thats ~10 recipes for bronze decorations.

I'm also not sure I could even fit it into BAC. Remember one of the goals for BAC is to leave 1-2 menus open for customization. Items created keep their properties so long as you leave any graphics in you can on/off custom mods as your character is doing different things.

If the other ore mod is developed it could be BAC Compatible without being in the core BAC mod maintained in this thread.

[Signatus]

Coins maybe not, but ingots? Small ingots of metal were likely traded at this time, heck they've found stone in much earlier sites that's non native that likely would have been traded. People trade whatever's valuable.

Trick is how to put this into the economy.

  - Shane

My idea was something like this, though originally I was testing a way to find the exact price of things by getting naked and holding only the coins while trading, then asking what they prefer (worked). The weights for gold and silver coins are based on the most ancient coins found from Persia. The idea is that you could work them into something valuable as well, but also have a "billet" or ingot form to be able to melt stuff into.

The weapons menu seem to havr enough space for some gold/silver/bronze weapons (with different values based on weapon type) but other objects could get the appropriate tagging if "X bloom" and "X ore piece" werr changed to "bloom of X", "ore of X", etc... as happens with fibres already. This would allow naming the item depending on the ore used.

The problem is that pricing these items differently would require commenting in/out a price tag. While simple and solving the space problem, it requires this manual action. But you could have a silver hammer or a golden pot!

This could be extended to other items like "Arrowhead of iron/silver/gold" used with [naming:last word]

The roasting and smelting can easily fit into the mining and and ironworking menus, I think.

I used the gold to silver ratio of 1 to 20 and about the same of silver to copper though it appears to have remained about 0.1 to 0.3 throughout history. The coin idea might need balancing to make it not broken and less valuable for the effort, resources and tools needed (don't forget that) but it could work with the idea of the metalworker in mind.

Also, bronze could be melted from bronze brooches and stuff, giving them a new purpose. Alternatively, we could mix iron and copper together to make bronze.

Edit: btw, copper, silver and gold do occur naturally, and I know there's deposits of gold in finland. Finding them should be hard, kinda balancing it out.

Edit: another option would be having a swappable menu with the bronze/etc crafting recipes

[Acolyte]

I do think it could be an interesting chat in another thread.

Fair enough. 

And done! https://www.unrealworld.fi/forums/index.php?topic=4740.0

BTW, I don't use much of this mod, but the parts I do use are fantastic!

   - Shane