Patreon

[Dark Art]

Hey guys, have you heard about Patreon? If not, you absolutely should have a look at that platform. When you guys moved to donation based payments, it didnt exist yet, but now it looks like a very good option for you (strictly IMHO of course). I use it to support a few journalists and bloggers, but from what I understand its mainly used to provide crowd based support for folks like you. In short, it provides a pretty safe, reliable and completely hassle free monthly based subscriptions for your support base and some additional exposure to potential gamers. I am just a supporter there, but if you guys will need some help setting that thing up, I think I can ask more detailed, technical info from a person I support there.

[Erkka]

Hello!

Yeah we are aware of Patreon. But maybe we are just too old school to really figure out how it makes things easier compared to the "set up a regular monthly donation"-system already offered by PayPal. Although - it might be that the PayPal way of placing a monthly donation is not actively promoted at the moment, so I do understand that it requires a bit too many clicks for the supporter to figure out such an option exists. I think we need to think about this 

[Dark Art]

Good to see you Erkka Damn its good to be back after some years and see a friendly face!

Trust me, Patreon is easy as it gets for end user. I've pushed one blogger into it and it did take him a bit of fiddling around to set it up, bit once its up and running its completely hassle free. In the end, your users will end up with a version of a blog where you post your updates, much like you do on the forum and on a side there will be a list of possible subscription options (you set up the ranges - anything from 1$ to 100$ or more per month), The only thing Patreon is trying to avoid is hot or controversial political debates, but you guys have nothing to worry about there. You might have to pass some kind of screening of course, but again, I am sure that will not be a problem.

And no, you are not THAT old school, not to the point of turning a blind eye to an excellent opportunity to promote your product and make a buck. I know you guys are better than this. If (or rather when:)) you'll decide to give it a try, let me know if you'll need some help setting the thing up and I'll see what can be done.

[JEB Davis]

IMHO, using Patreon could be a good move on your part, Erkka.

I use your current PayPal method for monthly donations to UrW.
And also use Patreon for the same thing with another game.

Comparing my experience with them gives Patreon a clear win.

[Erkka]

Comparing my experience with them gives Patreon a clear win.

That has been my main question - for the fan / supporter what is the difference between using Patreon or directly using PayPal, and I've always somehow assumed that the difference isn't that big - one just hits a button at this or that platform, yes?

But if JEB Davis says that using Patreon feels a lot easier that using PayPal regular donations, then I've been mistaken and I would be glad to hear more abou the differences - how is Patreon easier, what are the pros (and, alternatively, what are the cons of PayPal?)

(Also, this is what I meant by saying that I'm probably bit too old school - I'm aware that Patreon exists, but I haven't used it that much. Also, I have very limited user experience with PayPal, so I really can't base my judgements on my own experience. Therefore I'm more than happy to be educated by those who have have more user experience with different platforms.)

Ps. personally I've long since decided to keep my blog strictly non-monetized. But sometimes we have discussed with Sami about a possibility to set up a Patreon profile for not-strictly-urw-related-stuff like producing videos and music. But then the developer life tends to be overwhelmed with so many things coming and going that we haven't been discussing Patreon ideas for a while.

Pps. Sligthly sidetracking the thread - for another ideas tagged 'in-the-future-possibly-maybe', I'd like to ask if anyone has anything to say if different crowdfunding platforms make any difference for the user? Does it matter if one chooses Kickstarter or Indiegogo? Or, a Finland-based alternative mesenaatti.me - would a less known Finnish alternative turn away potential funders? Or is it so that the platform matters less and it is the quality of the proejct which affects when people choose if they are willing to participate in crowdfunding a project?

[Dark Art]

For one thing, not every one has PayPal. Secondly, not every country supports it. In Patreon, you dont need a 3rd party - just give them your credit card, select the amount, frequency and you are good to go for as long as you want. Cancellation is equally easy.

See, thats the thing - you dont really need to keep your blog locked up for paying patrons only. You can keep it just as open to everyone and have only selected posts marked visible for paying patrons. Say those "thank you" videos you guys post from time to time. Or something similar you have on this very forum - "Lifetimer Members' board". The only thing that'll change for you is the platform where you publish the blog. That and much easier interface for your supporters and additional exposure to potential gamers. I dont know exactly how it works, but I've seen other devs do some kind of cross-promo posts. Basically you tell your supporters about other creator's work on Patreon and they do the same thing for you.

[Dungeon Smash]

The nice thing about Patreon vs. Paypal is that the default assumption with Patreon is that you will be making recurring payments.  It might be possible to set this up in Paypal, but I don't know and I've never tried.  However, I do support several Patreons in this manner - it's as simple as entering your credit card info, typing the amount you wish to contribute each month, and clicking the button.  In addition, the framework of Patreon makes it easy to give "rewards" to your contributors - when they go on the Patreon website they can easily see a list of all the special posts you've made exclusively for patrons, such as videos, songs, special messages etc.  As well as the special posts of all the other Patreons they support, in one place. 
You could do all this stuff via Paypal as well, but it would take a few extra steps.  The supporter would need to use Paypal to send you the money, then follow your instructions to navigate to a separate site to see the "rewards".  In addition, if they want to set up a continuing donation, they would need to learn how to do that on Paypal (if it's even possible - like I said, I don't know) or else remember to do so every month/week/whatever. 
For your business model I think it might make some sense, just my opinion.  Of course you could always keep Paypal as an option as well.

[JEB Davis]

Dark Art and Dungeon Smash have said it very well already so I'll just add a small personal comment.

I avoid PayPal and only use it when there is no other option; it's just user-unfriendly. I have to remember to keep a balance in the account or it will run dry and I don't think there is any communication from PayPal that would warn me of this beforehand.

Patreon is simple and just charges to my credit card so it's basically "hands-off" for me after the initial setup, which is great.

Heck... you could get a first-hand experience by shooting Tarn Adams an email, I'm guessing he wouldn't mind helping out a fellow developer at all!      tarn (dot) adams (at) gmail (dot) com

[Brygun]

Ive had Paypal over draw my bank account over a $9 game causing me $45 over draft charges. 

I've not yet used Patreon.

I will say in the game development industry the "industry standard" is to direct people to a Patreon page. I no longer hear of devs/youtubers/funders using the phrase paypal anymore.